0305-Clarke-Jonathan Strange & Mr. Norell: Comments

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Wed, 10 Aug 2005 15:04:17 -0500

I know I'm way late on this. And perhaps no one will read my comment. But as I have one last CD (the 26th!) of this book to listen to, I can't help myself.

I LOVE this book. I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE it. I love how it progresses from a fairly light social satire to a scary, dark, wild thing full of magic. I can't get the image out of my head of Strange moving about in his pillar of darkness. I love how the characters develop over time and how the character flaws in Lascelles and Drawlight twist and grow until these odious men are destroyed in very fitting ways.

I think the best way to enjoy this book is to listen to it rather than read it. That way you can knit and "read" at the same time. Why, in the time it's taken to read this book, I've knit a pair of socks, a sleeve of the Lucky cardigan and a sleeve on a sweater I'm making for my husband (plus I traveled all around my home state of Idaho while magic was restored to England).

I'm also a fan of any author who messes around with genre and history. This novel does both. So there. I'm feeling better. And now, for the last disc!

- emily

Comment on "So, my opinion..."

Sun, 29 May 2005 02:15:36 -0500

Yeah, I'd have to agree. It didn't actually *go* anywhere, and I ended up just stopping about 1/4 of the way in. Too much knitting and other things going on to really spend much time on an iffy book. I ended up starting on the Time Traveler's Wife instead.

- Eva

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Wed, 25 May 2005 15:09:16 -0500

I am listening to the audio version and am around Chapter 30.

If someone asked me what the plot line of this book was, the only thing I would be able to tell them would be "Magic returns to early 19th century England. This is about two magicians" I guess I feel a story, especially of this length needs more glue in the plot line to keep the reader willing to read the entire book (or listen to all 26 CD's!). Take for example Lord of the Rings; not a short read, however the ongoing conflict made me not want to put the book down.

Currently, it almost seems like a book of short stories. You have the story about the "Man with the Thistle Down Hair and Lady Pole" and "The Story of Jonathan Strange" Sure the stories overlap some, but it seems very disconnected.
I must say that I completely agree with everyone that has not been able to make it through the entire book.....I'll have to wait and see if I do.

- Erin

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Mon, 16 May 2005 17:13:33 -0500

I gave up on this book at p.124. I like it well enough, but found my attention wandering. Thank you to everyone who finished the book and liked it. I'll try again.

- Donna

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Thu, 12 May 2005 15:48:28 -0500

I loved this book! I will have to say that I listened to the audio version of the book and think that may be why I was able to finish.

I think that the beginning was a little slow as we had to wait for the introduction of Strange. (Norell was not a character that I could easily identify with.) Once Strange was introduced, the story picked up quite a bit.

I agree that Arabella was the perfect partner for Strange. She definitely his anchor and without her, he did things that he probably shouldn't have.

I would be interested in 'reading' a sequel to this book. I felt the ending left you wondering what would happen to Strange and Norell and would Strange and Arabella be able to 'reconcile'.

That's all that I can remember for now. I'm in the middle of another book!!!

- Violet

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Wed, 11 May 2005 18:25:31 -0500

I have to admit that this one didn't grab me either. I really wanted to love it, as I love 19th century novels, fantasy/magic, and huge 800 page novels. None of the characters really made me want to love them, and though it did pick up the pace later on, it dragged on for the first 300 pages. I probably would read more of her work as she writes more, but I couldn't help agreeing with several reviewers that a good editing pen was what was needed here.

- Lorette

Comment on "So, my opinion..."

Tue, 10 May 2005 18:14:14 -0500

I read all sorts of different kinds of books--About the only kind I won't read is Horror (and I'm not a huge fan of westerns or Harlequin-style romances), but I'll read just about anything if it's recommended highly enough. I so wanted to enjoy this book! It had all the right things going for it, too, but I just couldn't bear the writing style. The tone of voice was fine and Victorian-esque for a while, but it just never actually went anywhere. Like I said, I love fantasy books, and read all sorts of differently-styled ones all the time. I'm always looking for more authors to love, and with the speed at which I read, that's not an easy thing to keep up with! This book, though. . . . wanted to throw it across the room, I was so frustrated with it.

- Deb

Comment on "So, my opinion..."

Tue, 10 May 2005 11:15:22 -0500

Well, since the character didn't have a name (and I actually thought that wasn't a bad thing), calling him "the gentleman with the thistle-down hair" (not thistle-hair, btw) was evocative and mysterious.

Deb, if you don't mind me asking, what fantasy books do you like? I like some kinds and can't abide others. We may just be on opposite ends of the spectrum here. Not a bad thing, just different.

And a question for you folks that didn't like the book: have you ever read any of the Patrick O'Brian Aubrey/Maturin novels? If so, did you like them?

I'm just curious about this, because I liked the book so much.

- Janice in Ga

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Tue, 10 May 2005 09:06:16 -0500

Mixed feelings on my part about this book. I received it as a holiday gift, and read it back in January. From the reviews, I expected something really great, and felt it was okay. I thought the writing style was very well done, and it was an interesting exercise. However, I thought the pacing was off, and there was a lot of slow buildup only to race to a conclusion. The plot felt secondary to her description, which was unfortunate.

Ultimately, I don't have much else to say about Strange & Norrell. It was entertainment, but not terribly substantial despite its weight. In terms of generating topics of discussion, I think the His Dark Materials series brought up more interesting concepts.

Just my 2 cents.

- Terby

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Mon, 09 May 2005 11:13:35 -0500

I find that you either like this kind of writing, or you don't. It's like Shakespeare -- you have to get into the rhythms of the language. If you have trouble with the reading part, try listening to an audiobook version. That's what I did. I found the footnotes to be less intrusive and more of an organic part of the story when I listened to it.

I also think some people may just have a visceral reaction to the fantasy bits of it. All I can say is, y'all missed out on a good story. I think this is one of the best books I've read in years.
It had stylish, meaty prose, interesting and well-drawn characters, and a plot that got better as the book went on. The story really picked up in the last quarter of the book, and the ending to me was IMMENSELY satisfying. I really liked that the author didn't settle for a pat "happy" ending.

I can't wait to read more from this author.

- Janice in Ga

Comment on "So, my opinion..."

Sat, 07 May 2005 10:42:38 -0500

Ha! Me too. Although I liked the footnotes, I thought they were funny and pompous. You got farther than I did--I gave up at around page 275. As I mentioned elsewhere, if I want to read Victorian, give me Jane Austen any day. However, this book did inspire me to stock up on Jane Austen courtesy of those nice and inexpensive Barnes & Noble editions.

- Amy

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Fri, 06 May 2005 12:37:28 -0500

Ok, this was to be my debut reading for this group. I loved Harry Potter books and had understood that this was the "adult" Harry Potter. I finally found it at the SFO book store and lugged it with me for the next 5 days in San Diego.

I'm sorry to say that I'm one of those who did not connect with it. I didn't feel any connection to the characters, I found the language and detail too much work.

So after about 250 pages, I gave up. I might go back and finish it someday, but I find myself picking up almost any other reading material instead, so it will go with my knitting UFO's for the time being.

- HoJo

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Thu, 05 May 2005 14:29:29 -0500

Sandy - your point about Arabella is well taken. You definitely get the sense that she's the right partner for him - smart and practical. That's why it was so utterly shocking when she "died." (Although of course I should have seen that coming...)

Amy - I love Ian McEwan! Have you read Atonement? It's wonderful...

- Elizabeth

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Wed, 04 May 2005 19:30:08 -0500

I admit, too, that it was a tough slog for me, for some reason. I could never connect with any of the characters, and I guess I need that connection. I adore big weighty tomes, like Moby Dick and all of Dickens, and A Soldier of the Great War, so that wasn't it. It just never touched me.

- Patti

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Wed, 04 May 2005 14:03:45 -0500

OK, I'll be the contrarian...I got 300 pages into this book after much effort, and gave up. I liked the writing style--but if I want to read something Jane Austen-esque, I'd rather read Jane Austen. It just didn't grab me in any way. Not that I have to have major "grabs" in every book I read, but it was far too easy to put down and forget about. Normally I give a book 50-75 pages before moving on, but I gave this one more, simply because it was so long, but ultimately...goodbye Clarke, hello Ian McEwan and Yarn Harlot.

- Amy

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Wed, 04 May 2005 01:07:10 -0500

I think I may have been one of the few to finish the book in March, so please bear with me, I've read a few other books in the interum.
I too found it difficult to read because of the language, not the fantasy. For me, it was the same way I feel when trying to get into an Austen novel. You have to get used to the writing before you catch on, and you're not thinking about the writing style any more.
I loved the scene where Stephen Black hears the bell ringing for Lost-Hope, and he helps the man with thistle-down hair get ready for a party, and the man thinks that Stephen should be a king instead of a student. I felt disappointed that we never learned the name his mother called Stephen, because the Raven King mentions it quite a lot. I was unsure though, whether to be happy or sad that Stephen became king of Lost-Hope.

I liked this book, but I felt for the length that is it, there were far too many loose ends laying about. It's as if the author started minor plot lines, and then forgot about them.

What happens to the King of England? What happens to Vinculus? Is Childermas a magician now? What happens to Miss Greysteal? And the strange mirror?

I am glad that there will be a sequal, and while she will probably tie up these loose ends, I hope she doesn't create more.

- lisa

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Mon, 02 May 2005 17:44:33 -0500

Just an aside: So glad to see everyone talking about the book! Don't forget, MJ was nice enough to jump start the discussion. I ~blush~ wasn't able to finish it in time!

Thank you for making K1R2 everything I hoped it would be!

Best,
Cara

- Knit One Read Too

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Mon, 02 May 2005 13:50:08 -0500

I loved this book, it may be one of my favorite ones of all time. The question I find most fascinating is the connection between magic and madness. Must you be mad to believe in magic the way some of the characters do? Where does magic end and madness begin (and vice versa)?

- *kim*

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Mon, 02 May 2005 12:18:02 -0500

I, too adored this book, and having finished it a few weeks, ago, still lament that I am no longer living in this world to which I had becomed so accustomed. Indeed, I miss the atmosphere, the characters, the possibilities. . .

Echoing Elizabeth, Childermass was my favorite character as well, though not at the first. This complexity was something I appreciated throughout the book and with all the characters--really not one of them without faults and weaknesses, as well as strengths.

As for the manipulative Mr. Lascelles--eternal manipulation is entirely what he deserves!

The thing that struck me, and continues to amaze me each time I consider it, is Clarke's apparently voluminous research. To consider what she must have had to make herself familiar with in order to create a believable mythology of English magic is astounding. It reminds me, in terms of attention to background detail, of Anne Rice's creation of a credible vampire mythology.

Perhaps my most favorite scene came right at the beginning ~ Mr. Norrell's magic in the cathedral. This was so original and breathtaking that it made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up. While I loved many other scenes, as well, this particular one convinced me that I was in for a treat with this novel, and I wasn't disappointed.

And might I just mention how HORRIFIED I was for Mr. Norrell to treat Mr. Strange's book publishing debut in so callow a manner? Surely every author's worst nightmare.

- Laurie

Comment on "Book Discussion Begins!"

Mon, 02 May 2005 11:21:39 -0500

Elizabeth - I disagree with you on one point only - I think Arabella (Mrs. Strange) was a wonderful character, and tough in her own way. I think she (and not Mr. Norrell) provided a balance to Mr. Strange's life that kept him from going over the edge like he did when she was gone. That's probably why I was so fussed at the ending - it seems like with only Mr. Norrell as a companion, Mr. Strange's obsessive tendencies would not be checked and could still be dangerous.

I, too, noticed the overall lack of strong female characters, but I didn't necessarily miss them. It fit with the feel of the book. But it would be quite interesting for her to pick up a strong female lead in the sequel!

- Sandy J